Posted by Jim Henderson on: 02.09.2006 /
Got these comments from Bill and Paul after my recent post - which most closely expresses your view?
Bill wrote…
“Are you serious? How dissected from reality do you have to become to believe that lying to someone is “showing the love of God” and telling them the truth - that there will come a day when we will stand before Jesus Christ and be judged in righteousness, those covered by the blood of Jesus Christ through Godly repentance and faith in Jesus Christ will receive eternal life while those who do not repent and/or put their faith in Jesus Christ alone will be condemned to the fires of Hell for eternity - is somehow wrong-headed and misguided?
I would simply ask you Mr. Henderson if you are aware Hemant has said your money will be going to support an organization that is bent on scraping every last bit of Godly presence out of schools and society in general? How does someone get so pumped up in himself that he loses complete sight of the responsibility to be an ambassador for Christ and rather misguidedly throws money at someone to simply get him “churched” for a time so he might possibly get “saved” when the message delivered to Hemant by Kirk Cameron could not have been better stated that there are fewer and fewer churches in America where the Bible plan of salvation is being adhered to and taught.
Congrats Mr. Henderson on your donation to the wicked God-haters club known as the Secular Students Alliance. What a way to honor you Creator.
Love does not lie or deceive but has the willingness to lose a relationship to save a soul and to put God before man that the man-to-man relationship would be on a solid foundation rather than a slippery slope of self-delusion”
Paul wrote…
“It’s an interesting thought - here’s someone in Hemant who is doing something that I wouldn’t do - i guess the mirror image would be to sell going to mosques, or to an athesiest rally or a gay club - and yet he’s doing this. What does that tell you about the man, to be I think he is doing an awesome, brave, adventurous thang and I hope he has a great time doing it!”
Comment by: kim
1I agree with Paul.
Treating those you disagree with as you would wish to be treated is hardly lying. And I would ask Bill to take a second look at the ministry of Jesus - he didn’t walk around losing relationships to win souls. He walked around loving, healing and helping people to show them that we have a God who wants a relationship, even with people like us.
Comment by: KSG
2Hey Bill,
Being an outside observer on all things American (I’m a Canuck) I’d have to say that the great American method of condemnation, instead of treating someone like a fellow human and making connections or having conversations, has been obviously highly effective in America. I mean look, as Christians you’ve practically converted your entire country! There’s no crime, people don’t have broken lives or marriages anymore, everyone loves each other and puts their fellow man first. In your bible belt region you’ve caused the extinction of such vices as homosexuality, gambling, pornography, drug addiction, etc. the list goes on and on… Congratulations! You’ve given the rest of the christian world an example to follow. Kudo’s to you!
I apologize if I offend any fellow believers with my sarcasm. I simply want to make the point that critisizm of each other is as effective with one another as condemnation is to a heathen. I heard a(hellfire)pastor recently say that his wife knows not to preach at him about an error or sin in his life because it will go over like a lead balloon, that she (his wife) knows that she needs to carefully and thoughtfully show him his error (a process of time). If that’s the case for a seasoned, long-term man of God, how much more so for you and I or the person ignorant about God, his son, and the relationship they want with you and I. We are not hunters going in for the kill, we’re farmers who plant and water, while our father harvests.
Grace is a beautiful thing. Use it wisely. :)
Comment by: Dean
3Bill,
Do you want people to listen or just to hate you and turn from you and walk away? If you want people to listen to you, I would suggest that we need to learn to listen to them first. Your attitude suggests that we should never develop relationship with people who have differing opinions from ourselves. Jesus ate with those who did not subscribe to His way of life and their is no evidence that all who “hung out” with Jesus eventually became followers. Why do Christians need to be so hateful toward people who don’t agree with us? Why not listen to Hemant’s story? Why not get to know Him? Why not understand what it is about God that he rejects? Why not care about him whether he accepts your beliefs or not? Please site one instance in Scripture in which Jesus smacks down a non-believer. Remember: It is His kindness that leads us to repentance (Romans 2:1-4).
Comment by: David Buckham in St. Petersburg, Florida
4Bill did get a couple of things right. “Congrats Mr. Henderson…” and I will stop there. I think it’s a phenominal idea. Okay so your $504 is going to a bad cause. But what you purchased is going to a good cause. How many times have Christians bought something (anything) that in the end goes to a bad cause. Whether it’s movies, theme parks, a restaurant that sells “drinks”, or a bar of soap (oh the unchecked rumors:)) And what a door that has just been opened up with Hemant and that Hemant is opening up for us. WOW! Thank you for a most definate ordinary attempt at evangelism. I know the pop phrase is thinking out side of the box, I like to think that there is no box when it comes to reaching the missing. I feel this is definately a case of there is no box. So in the words of Bill, “Congrats Mr. Henderson.”
all about Christ,
David
Comment by: Lucca
5Bill…you are the reason I and millions of other people don’t go to church and have a real dislike of christians….congrats to you Bill for carrying on the legacy of the bible toting extreme right…that is so out of touch with what love and acceptance really should be…it actually makes me sick to my stomach… but at least you are a catalyst for people’s desire to change, away from what you believe…so thanks..
Comment by: David Buckham in St. Petersburg, Florida
6I forgot to turn the italics off. Sorry guys.
David
Comment by: Peter J. Walker
7Hemant,
I’m so glad you’re working with Off-The-Map, but I’m also just so sorry you have to see our dirty underbelly. It’s a good thing - we need to be exposed, but you’re going to see far more dirtiness than any of us like. Thank you for this undertaking. I pray that lives will be changed as readers are subjected to your influence and perspective on individual posters like the ungracious, above.
On the other hand, before we’re all so disparaging toward “Bill,” how many of us hide the same kinds of intolerance in our hearts, but simply manifest them in more “Politically Correct” ways? Too often we point our fingers at the perpetrators of our own sins and sigh in relief that we didn’t get caught, ourselves.
I pray I don’t have the anger toward the unchurched that Bill does, but I won’t bet money on it. There are dark parts of me that need light exposed. In a very ironic twist (at least, ironic to a lifelong Christian) it is a non-Christian who is shining the light of Truth into our dark corners.
Blessings, truly,
Comment by: jen lemen
8um, paul, hands down.
but i’m panicked that they have comments turned on for this blog because christians can be soooooo nasty and it’s only a matter of time before the comment sections because “the” place on the blogosphere to beat up the atheist.
seriously, consider turning them off.
Comment by: Jim Henderson
9Jen
We’ve got his back
Comment by: Daniel Morgan
10As a recently deconverted Christian, I am still able to be incited to anger by the words of small minds like Bill’s. I was a Xian for some 20 years, and I was a fundamentalist (as Bill appears), I youth pastored at 2 churches, I led revivals and “led many to the Lord” (via the Holy Spirit, of course).
What Bill (and so many others) remind me of are the words of Ghandi:
Of course, Ghandi is just burning in hell, right? So who cares, right, Bill? Funniest thing is, when I read the NT, I see absolutely no time that Jesus mentions hell around anyone but Pharisees (Bills). I also see, if you stick to the more-reliable Synoptics, a Jesus who sounds as much like Bill as Foghorn Leghorn sounds like a Yankee.
Comment by: Chris Ewing
11Bill I’m not sure about your god, but my God is bigger than $504.00. He can use that money in many different ways for His kingdom even in the hands of the unbelievers.
I once had someone tell me that I have no grounds to speak to them about Christ or any other religious matter. They said this because they viewed me as just another Christian kid. You know, the ones that believe what their parents believed and didn’t truly find Christ on their own. So I started searching through other religions. At this point in my life I have taken three religion classes at college (a couple from a secular university), started my library of world religions, and have sat down with many people to find out what they believe. A close friend of mine is an Atheist and we have debated many times. I have sat down with Pagans that share with me what they believe and all their rituals. I do this for a better understanding so that I may know how to effectively wittness to others later. Even Jesus’ deciples went to the secular philosophers of that day. They did it to know how to best share the gospel with the people.
Just know that whatever we say or do will never convince anyone that God exists. You can know the scriptures forward and back, have all of them memorized and still not know God. Just simply look in some of the Christian schools and you will see many of these poeple. It is only till God calls you that you will be saved. I hope and pray that many of our eyes and hearts will be opened through this experence that one atheist has chosen to go on.
Comment by: Texan
12Very well said Chris.