Posted by Jim Henderson on: 03.27.2006 /
From Comment # 2 Firstimers Comments
“Everyone makes a choice to be a believer or a non-believer (Atheist). After one is tuned into that belief system by reading, listening and seeing everything from that point of view”…
“Some people say that there is no God, and that He never speaks to us anymore. But perhaps they can’t see or hear Him because they aren’t listening for Him. If you are in tune with God, you will be able to notice Him at work in your life and in the world. And you’ll be able to hear Him when He speaks. It is your choice”
Comment by: Esther
1Hi, everyone,
What I’m go’in to share is a little long, sorry about that.
Funny is that I’ve already written this to Ir privately last Sat. She suggested me to post it here. I was just thinking on which blog I should post it and “Bang” this topic comes up.
So, here’s the real story I’m going to share:
Last Saturday I’ve spent with Daniella, a 47 yrs old woman from Slovaskia. I knew her through a choir we both wanted to join and we just “clicked” and became good friends. She always wanted to leave her country and explore the world. Finally, last year, she came to Vancouver, BC, Canada as a live-in nanny.
She did not have any religion but is a very spiritual woman. I guess when one was brought up in the western world (Europe in her case), one must have known catholic or protestant faith. That was her case as well. Yet, she was also totally dispised human religion. She reads a lot of books and has her own thinking about life, karma, and God.
We have not spent time with each other for 4 months until this afternoon. She has been terminated (unfairly) from her nanny job with this family and she’ll need to move out of their home the end of this month. She is still looking for another live-in nanny job and have not got one yet. She is to face a homeless and jobless future in 5 days.
However, when I saw her this afternoon, she is far from despair. Her face actually glow.
She told me excitedly that out of her own expectation, she finally found God a few weeks ago. She now does not have any fear. She knows that God will see her through.
I asked her (actually I already knew but just wanted to hear from her mouth) which God she has found in her life? Is it the Christian God, or the budda God?
She said those are just human religions. Her God is no religion. She does not know WHO this God is but she doesn’t care. Later, we discussed more and have come up with more elaboration on this. What we can say of this God maybe the source of all goodness. The higher power that will gives us strength, and wisdom to do good.
So, how did she find this God? She said all her life she was searching for God. She envied people that were so sure that they have God and seemed to live a life full of hope and strength… But honestly, she has never felt God. She would pray to God for she believes God is there but never really “met” with God.
It was until she went through this ordeal of having all these unfair treatment from her boss and conflict with this family. In several occasions, she deeply sensed that God was helping her to make the right decisions, have the right attitude to face this challenging situation.
And most important of all, many many times when she was in despair, she would feel this unexplainable warmth coming through her heart and gave her inner peace. She said she now really could feel God. She was so happy. She said her whole outlook on life has changed. Before, she used to worry about everything. Now, even she maybe living on the street, she is not worried.
WOW, I was speechless!
First, I was stunned for the fact that just when I have experienced this “Atheist Blog FEVER” and just have excelerated into all these doubts about whether the Bible is truly ALL the words of God, and how I’m going to keep my faith in God, here comes Daniella’s story!
The most amazing part is that Daniella’s “convertion” or her encounterment with God is clearly NOT the Christian God. Her faith is clearly NOT the Bible-believing Xian’s faith. Yet, her experience of having God’s guidance, her inner strength, peace & joy, and the warmth she felt in her heart are all very similar with what many/most converted Xians ALSO have experienced.
My thinking is that could there be a God who is the source of goodness and love. This God is NOT what and how many manmade or man-conteminated religions had described. But, for anyone who at the right time has felt or met with this God, will have a life-changing experience.
Comment by: Brent
2Esther,
What draws you to that conclusion?
Comment by: Julie Marie
3I love to see that “peace that passes understanding.”
Esther, thanks for sharing an experiential story.
I do believe we all have a choice in what to believe. In my life, the choice lies in how I chose to interpret my experience. I have been heavily influenced by Viktor Frankel’s Will to Meaning. Sometimes the only control-able variable is how we choose to react.
I have not been a lifelong Christian, although I have been a lifelong spiritualist. (is that a classification, I wonder?) I am not, as some have characterized, a blind lamb bleating to a pair of black socks for vision. I have sought, tried on, and discarded a handful of philosophies, and have found that the supernatural power of the Christian God best explains my experience.
Comment by: Tom in Sacramento
4Esther, Brent asks THE critical question. As I noted somewhere else, there are only three possibilities: 0 gods, 1 God, more than 1 gods.
It sounds like your friend’s experience has convinced her that there is 1 God. (Any of us know the difference between “meeting” one person and “meeting” a crowd of people.)
So, then, there are just a few critical questions. The first is, is your friend’s story consistent or inconsistent with the God of Judaism, Christianity, or Islam (the three major “1 God religions”)? Speaking as a Christian, I would say it is certainly consistent with the God of Christianity.
And, as for your doubts about the Bible: I would encourage you to explore them. And, moreover, I think the Bible encourages you to explore them.
Fear not. Perfect love casts out fear. You shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free. Seek and you will find.
Tom
Comment by: Esther
5Thanks, Julie & Tom,
You guys are very keen and sharp in thinking!
I actually have been thinking in my mind about that line that I wrote!
The most amazing part is that Daniella’s “convertion” or her encounterment with God is clearly NOT the Christian God.
I was thinking maybe I shouldn’t be that absolute. Infact, I don’t know one way or the other. So, I shouldn’t have said that.
Yes, thanks for pointing out, Julie. I’ll take that conclusion back.
As for now, I’ll just keep searching with my true heart.
Thank you all for your lovingly encouragement!
Comment by: Esther
6Tom said,
It sounds like your friend’s experience has convinced her that there is 1 God.
Speaking as a Christian, I would say it is certainly consistent with the God of Christianity.
Tom,
I would say that the God my friend has experienced matches with the general idea Xians or other religious people hold with the concept of GOD.
But, I don’t see that representing the God in the Bible in particular.
Since my friend will not “study” the Bible as the word of God and follow the teaching of the Bible through the interpretation of the church, she’ll not attend a Xian’s Church and get baptised…so on and so forth….
How so do you say that to you, the God she’s met with or began to have a close relationship with is the Christian God?
I have to go.
I’ll check in later.
Comment by: Tom in Sacramento
7Esther, if Daniella was my friend, presumably she would have some idea that I had an interest in spiritual things. Most of my friends and acquaintances do, though probably not all. As a result, when they tell me such experiences of theirs I think they know I’ll be interested (as opposed to some people who just bolw it off), that I will take them seriously and respectfully, and, I think (I hope) they trust me enough to feel that I would be able to help them evaluate their experience. (Although I have not had any friends experience an encounter as dramatic as Daniella’s, I have had some generally similar situations.)
Given Daniella’s present distaste and distrust for the church, I would not evenpoint her in that direction, or even toward the Bible at this point. I’d simply affirm her experience and, where I could, draw parallels with my own understanding of God. And, for the time being, I’d leave Jesus out of it, too.
In botany, when a seed sprouts it will naturally grow towards the sun; you don’t have to force it. In the same way, if a person encounters God, they will naturally grow towards the Son; that doesn’t have to be forced either. Organic growth is always better than engineered efforts to produce something. God is competent to manage His own affairs. All we need to do is trust Him and wait until He presents us with an opportunity.
Tom
Comment by: TXatheist
8Tom,
Can you answer #37 on Another atheist goes to church, preferably in that topic if you would. I’m also curious as to the atheist that we atheists actually embarrasses us. Who would that be? Thanks.
Comment by: Hifi
9Firstimer, said, “If you are in tune with God, you will be able to notice Him…and you’ll be able to hear Him when He speaks.”
Tom said, “If you encounter God…”
Two questions:
1) How do you know it is God, or if it is which one? Does he/she announce herself by name so you will know? Or, as I assume, if it is a vague feeling of knowing, then how do you identify it? (My hypothesis, there is a capacity in us all for this kind of experience and whatever religious culture is ready at hand will fill in the content, which the person having the experience will use for to define it. This would be the same way we learn language: universal capacity with purely relative content supplied by the local culture.)
2) Because this confirmation is inside your head, why do you assume it is just not another part of yourself such as Jung’s “wise old man?” or just a common hallucination.
“…more than 70 percent of a sample of 375 college students had at some time experienced an auditory hallucination of hearing voices while they were awake. Such hallucinations may readily be mistaken for ghosts or taken as evidence of the paranormal by those experiencing them. This is especially true since the high frequency of these waking hallucinations is not a well-known finding.”
BTW, I’ve had this experience, myself. Curious feeling of significance and presence. Never felt obligated to attribute it to my parent’s religion though.
Comment by: Esther
10Tom,
Thanks for your attempt to answer me.
However, that was not my question.
I was not asking you how I can lead Daniella to our Christian God.
I was just asking base on what you think that the God she has encountered was very much assemble the Christian God?
You were assuming that the only one God is the Christian God. But, could it be just as Daniella has mentioned, this God is no religion and He has his own way to relate to people?
Comment by: HappyNat
11Everyone makes a choice to be a believer or a non-believer (Atheist).
I disagree with this statement, believing is not like turning on a switch. I was raised as a Christian and was very active in Church. I was taught about the Bible and Jesus and accepted these teachings as the truth. I didn’t choose to believe these things, they were just what everyone else believed so I believed it as well.
In my 20s I had many questions and went looking for answers. I read the Bible, as well as other religious books and philosophies. I tried to find ways to explain my beliefs in Christianity, as it was a major part of my life. In the end I was making more excuses than I could keep track of to “make myself a Christian”. In the end, I realized I could not choose to be a Christian anymore.
I was an atheist because of what I had studied and thought about. I wouldn’t choose to be the least trusted segment of American society, but this is what I believed. The day I accepted that was one of the best days of my life.
Comment by: Siamang
12Wow, great story HappyNat.
Thanks for sharing.
Comment by: Carin Nel
13Dear HappiNat, you still made the definite choice not to believe what you were taught as a child when you started looking for answers in your twenties. Tou made that switch. I must just make it very clear that true Christians have a relationship with Godn not a religion. Carin Nel
Comment by: Carin Nel
14Tom, when a Christian has a relationship with the iving God, he/she know very well what that still, small voice sounds like. One learns to distinguish very clearly between one’s own thoughts and the voice of God. Carin
Comment by: Carin Nel
15Because God knows exactly what we are searching for, He will fill that need, so don’t worry about Who He is in the sense of Christian God, or Hindu god etc. from a human perspective, if someone truly seek
Comment by: Hifi
16Carin,
I doubt your ecumenicalism, that you are extending even across cultures, is shared by hardly any adherent of the religions you site. The exception is Hindu. They are the only religion I know of whose doctrine states that God appears in infinite forms to man. (Probably why there can be several thousand gods worshipped in India.) Hindus recognize Jesus as one more incarnation of the mega-diety Ram. This helps a country, with 200 languages and changes in dialect every 20 miles, function without being at each other’s throats. But Christianity doesn’t worry about which God or religion you’ve gotten involved in? No way.
As to your personal belief, you can imagine to an atheist how that sounds like a serious opportunity for self-deception, even major manipulation by a cult.
BTW
Q: What’s the difference between a cult and a religion?
A: The number of people involved.