Posted by Siamang on: 02.27.2007 /
By Siamang
Unless you’ve been parked on the planet Mungo for a week, you know that the King of the World claims to have found a box that previously contained the bones of somebody named Jesus.
There are various claims of DNA evidence and other evidence, including the names of others found with this ossuary that line up with some of the biblical names of Jesus’ family and/or friends. And then there are some extra folks that the Bible doesn’t talk about, and James Cameron draws the dotted lines to ask… “did Jesus have two sons?”
Ben Witherington has a skeptical look at the claims.
I am hopeful, however, about this. I have hope that this incident will provoke people in general and Christians specifically to practice looking at claims skeptically. I note that Christians reject this claim because it flatly contradicts Christian tradition about Jesus’ resurrection. I have read the reactions of atheists like PZ Meyers who reject it for being poor scholarship amazingly unsupported by the find.
But I do have hope that people will use something like this to think about skepticism and the reasons why this claim is not credible.
Myself as a person who does not believe in Biblical inerrency STILL has a strong skepticism about the claims of James Cameron. I think there’s an interesting lesson there, that there are some things that Christians and non-Christians can come to a consensus about based on the facts on the ground. We can agree that the King of the World is more PT Barnum than Howard Carter.
-Siamang
And I do get an ironic chuckle from that Discovery Channel link above. The page features an ad for another Discovery Channel show, the skeptical “Mythbusters.”
Comment by: Mike O
1I made a statement quite a while ago that I would renounce my faith if “they ever found the body.” And I believe at that time, I was asked if I would believe it if someone did find the body and I admitted that it would take a lot of provin’.
I don’t believe it’s the body of Christ. But one thing this story does accomplish is that it helps me understand people who do not believe in God, and why it sounds so ridiculous to them.
How would anyone ever prove to me that this really is the body of Jesus? I have no idea because the whole idea seems ridiculous to me. Just like believing in God is ridiculous to atheists. And I suspect the thought processes I went through when I heard about this story are very similar to the thought processes an atheist goes through when presented with “proof” that there is a God.
Comment by: Ir (Helen)
2Wow, Mike, yes, I think that’s very much how it is for atheists.
I’m glad this gave you more insight into why atheists react the way they do to various things Christians tell them.
Comment by: Ir (Helen)
3Siamang, yes…it seems sort of ironic that when Christians and atheists agree a claim is ridiculous they also all agree that it’s appropriate to be skeptical and require much better evidence to back up the claim than they’ve seen so far.
But then when Christians are trying to convince atheists that they are right, then I’ve seen Christians start complaining that the atheists are being too skeptical.
In other words, as best I can tell their attitude is: it’s ok to be skeptical about the bones of Jesus box but it’s not ok to be as skeptical about the Bible.
But perhaps we are all inconsistent in the levels of skepticism we bring to various things.
Comment by: Siamang
4Personally, I cannot imagine how one might prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that any particular pile of bones was the historic Jesus.
As an atheist, I don’t think Jesus rose up into the sky. I expect the historical Jesus left behind some human remains. But I cannot for the life of me figure out how one could know that a particular human remains belonged to historic Jesus.
That said, THIS find is just a three-ring circus. I think it’s pretty clear they’ve got someone else.
It’s the Alien Autopsy or the Moon Landing Hoax? tv show all over again.
Where’s Geraldo?
Comment by: Ir (Helen)
5Siamang wrote:
…but I’m guessing it’s clear to you for very different reasons than “the Word of God and my personal experience of knowing the risen Jesus tell me ‘the tomb was empty’” ;-)
Actually you already implied that…never mind…
Comment by: Mike O
6I believe that statement is more true that anyone could ever imagine. I mean, think about it … if you believe something, how much supporting proof do you really need? On the other hand, if you reject it, you would be much more skeptical.
And I’m not even so sure that’s a bad thing … I think that’s just how it works. It take a lot of deliberate effort to be intellectually balanced. Most of the time, we don’t even know we’re doing it.
A great example is the differences between Christian denominations. We have differing beliefs on some of the periferal (sp?) things, but we’re SO SURE based on scripture that we’re right.
I think it’s very important to understand that those who do not agree with us probably believe what they do for very valid reasons.
Comment by: Ir (Helen)
7Mike O wrote:
Exactly. Their reasons are as valid to them as mine are to me.
Comment by: Lis
8SO WHERE ARE THE TOMBS OF JESUS’ 4 BROTHERS?
Ok, if these ossuaries really contain the bones of Jesus and his family, then where are the tombs of Jesus’ four brothers (yes! Jesus had siblings!) James, Simon, Joseph, and Judas??? See Matthew 13:55. There has been no mention of these tombs alongside the rest of their family. Very common names for these times, also.
Lisa
Comment by: Sobs Jobs
9Unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds.
An empty tomb, under Roman Guard’s watch, is the proof that He is risen. His life is in all who believe in Him and that is another proof.
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his unlimited patience as an example for those who would believe on him and receive eternal life.