Posted by Siamang on: 09.11.2007 /
By Siamang
The other day I was at Disneyland, in line for the “Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage” and I saw a T-shirt on a guest there. On the front side it said this:
If there is no God:
NOTHING MATTERS
If there is a God…
Then on the other side:
NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!
Other than remark to myself that I was clearly in Orange County, I didn’t think anything of it… He obviously doesn’t share my beliefs, that’s par for the course.
But Ebonmuse has another wonderful post at Daylight Atheism that addresses that subject with great grace and poetic beauty.
Meaning and accomplishment need not last forever to be significant. When we act now, in the present, we can make a difference in others’ lives here and now, and as far as I’m concerned, that is more than enough. It’s nothing but arrogant vanity to think that our acts must be remembered and praised for all time to be meaningful. This correspondent felt that “the long run”, meaning thousands or millions of years hence, is all that matters, but in fact it seems to me that the exact opposite is true: the present is what truly matters. The future can see to itself.
…
There is another profound implication for freethinkers. If Heaven is defined as eternal happiness, then we do not have to die to get there. We are already there. Any moment when you are happy, any moment when you feel joy - that moment exists forever.
Comment by: Stephan
1Great stuff, Siamang. I agree with everything Ebonmuse said. I truly have no hope of making an eternal difference in anyone’s life, but I can make a difference now, so that’s what I try to do. Like last week when I helped a handicapped woman return books at the library. Or this morning when I gave up my seat on the bus to someone else. I improved the quality of the day for each of those people (and myself) and carved out a slice of heaven on earth.
I understand the sentiment of the t-shirt, even though I don’t wholeheartedly embrace it. If there is no god, eventually all of us will cease to exist and, as Kansas put it, everything is dust in the wind (great song, by the way). That logic is what leads Christians to erroneously think atheists have no reason to live a moral life. If this all ends when we die, why even put forth the effort? The atheists I have met don’t live with that attitude at all, so I don’t buy the reasoning (or the t-shirt).
Comment by: Ir (Helen)
2Stephan wrote:
Right - me too. And it seems to me that whether someone is a Christian, atheist or someone in between, this might be reason enough to do small acts of kindness: “I improved their day a bit - I made a difference”.
I see that as meaningful.
Comment by: Julie
3Siamang, if you had any guts, you would have worn your Atheists tee shirt to Disneyland!
Comment by: Siamang
4HA!
Don’t think I didn’t consider it.
Comment by: Stephan
5Hey, Disney employs an outspoken atheist to write the music for most of its kids movies, so I don’t think they have a problem with it.
Comment by: Siamang
6Who is that?
Comment by: Stephan
7Randy Newman.
Comment by: Siamang
8Documentation?
I hear his father was an outspoken atheist, Irving Newman.
http://atheism.about.com/b/a/031576.htm
So many of Randy’s songs are written “in character” that I’m not altogether certain he is an atheist.
Anyway, I didn’t think I’d have any problem with Disney. I just didn’t want to have a day of let’s call them “Orange County Residents” picking arguments with me in line.
Comment by: Stephan
9Ok, you asked for it.
Celeb Atheists
Somebody’s blog
A review on Amazon
Atheist Alliance
Salon Article
That should do it.
I know you have said in the past that part of your reticence in “coming out” is that you work for a family entertainment company. Well, Disney does not seem to have a problem with Randy, so I doubt the company you work for would have a problem with you, unless you consider them to be much more conservative than Disney. (I say that knowing what company you work for, but not wanting to “out” you to others who do not.)
Comment by: Karen
10I worked at Disneyland in the late 70s. The employees at the gate were trained to deny entry to anyone who looked like a hippie (long hair, beard, dirty clothes) or was wearing a T shirt with an “offensive” message, by which I mean counterculture or containing profanity, etc. I believe those with offending T-shirts were told they could come in if they turned them inside-out so the wording didn’t show. The reasoning was that they would ruin the family atmosphere within the park.
I believe there was a court challenge to this policy which Disneyland eventually lost, but I’m not positive about that … so I don’t know what would happen with an atheist T-shirt. Probably nothing these days.
There was also a court case (or at least a highly publicized kerfuffle) over Disneyland ejecting same-sex couples dancing together at disco nights they used to have.
Interestingly enough, at the same time they were taking those gays off the dance floor during public park hours, Disneyland was also hosting private parties for gay groups, although they booked under a euphemism that didn’t include the words homosexual, gay, lesbian, etc. This was back in the late 70s, when very few gay people were out of the closet and those annual private parties were some of the first “official” gay social events at a major venue.
Comment by: Siamang
11Stephan, in what one of those links is Randy Newman an “outspoken” atheist?
I’m picturing a Richard Dawkins or at least a Phillip Pullman or a Douglas Adams or maybe even a Carl Sagan.
The closest I could find : “I never had faith,” said Newman. “But I have respect for the idea. There’s no joy being an atheist.”
Hardly outspoken.
Karen, Disneyland doesn’t currently have any policy that would forbid my wearing that shirt.
Stephan, I’m “out” at work, there’s no problem with that.
The reason I don’t talk about my job is that when I blog here, it’s in a private capacity. I don’t want people to confuse my views with the company I work for.
Comment by: Stephan
12I guess he’s not outspoken like Dawkins, but he has done nothing to hide his atheism, and it’s out there for everyone to see.
His take on Faust is quite interesting. In the end, God and Satan realize that they are both just figments of Faust’s imagination, so the whole thing is pointless.
Comment by: Siamang
13I was unaware of Randy Newman’s beliefs before you pointed them out. I appreciate the info!
Comment by: Stephan
14I know I’m in the habit of writing dates down, but here’s another one.
I told Siamang something he didn’t already know.
I believe this is a first.